Is This a Good Idea? A Flying Saucer?

May 20, 2009

Cue up the spooky theremin music. 

What if we actually had a disc-shaped vehicle that could take off and land vertically,
hover, and fly without burning a drop of jet fuel, just like the alien spacecraft in The Day The Earth Stood Still?   (I’m talking about the 1951 version, not the recent Keanu Reeves remake.)

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The flying saucer would be powered by a magnetohydrodynamic drive, which would use electrodes to ionize the surrounding air and turn it into plasma. The plasma, in turn, would push against the non-ionized air surrounding the saucer and provide lift.

In addition to looking incredibly cool, in theory such a vehicle would have tremendous advantages. Unlike jet aircraft or helicopters, it wouldn’t have any moving parts that could malfunction. Plus, it would be much more stable and maneuverable, because unlike conventional aircraft, it wouldn’t depend upon the flow of air molecules around wings or rotor blades. (By the way, if you’re already mystified by that how that phenomenon produces flight, here’s a HowStuffWorks article on aerodynamics.)

A saucer using a magnetohydrodynamic drive could change direction, stop and start again very, very quickly. And it would be able to accelerate to hypersonic speeds, making it as fast as today’s most advanced experimental aircraft.

What would be the disadvantages? Hmm. Well, if the flying saucer became a commonplace, explainable phenomenon, thousands of UFO enthusiasts would have to find some other mysterious fascination to talk about. 

Actual human scientists and engineers from this planet got the idea of building flying saucers long before Kenneth Arnold’s famous June 1947 sighting of nine UFOs flying in formation in Washington state, which, along with the infamous Roswell “flying disk” the following month, touched off the modern cult of UFOology.

Back in the 1930s, Romanian aeronautics engineer Henri Coanda discovered the Coanda effect --that is, that airflow will follow a curved surface, rather than just continue in a straight line. The bending of the flow accelerates it and increases aerodynamic lift. This principle wouldn’t necessarily matter that much to our magnetohydrodynamic vehicle, but it did inspire aircraft designers to contemplate the advantages of a completely curved — that is, saucer-shaped — vehicle.

After World War II, a German engineer named Georg Klein claimed in newspaper interviews that Nazi scientists had in fact developed and flown a flying-saucer prototype capable of reaching nearly twice the speed of sound, but then destroyed them the discs to keep the technology out of the hands of the advancing Soviet forces. (Here’s a fascinating article from the Daily Kos Web site about it, which includes a reproduction of a declassified CIA summary of Klein’s claims.)

In the 1950s and early 1960s, the U.S. Air Force funded Canadian researchers’ development of a flying saucer called the Avrocar. Here’s a declassified 1955 Air Force report on the Avrocar, which insists that

This project should in no way be associated with any science fiction or ‘flying saucer’ stories because of its external appearance. The configuration was the result of an engineering investigation into the solution of a particular problem.
An examination of the AVRO proposal shows that the potential for a very high performance weapon system exists in the not-too-distant future. Although the proposal offers the USAF a potentially advanced weapon system having both vertical takeoff and military performance capabilities, there are numerous technical problems which must be solved before a successful development can be realized.

Unfortunately, the technical problems apparently persisted, and the Air Force canceled funding for the program in 1961. In the 1990s, though, the U.S. military did develop an experimental, robotic saucer called the Multipurpose Security and Surveillance Mission Platform (MSSMP), which looked a bit like a dog’s water bowl with a video camera attached.

More recently, though, a University of Florida mechanical and aerospace engineering associate professor named Subrata Roy has developed and patented a design for a “wingless electromagnetic air vehicle,” or WEAV, that ultimately could lead to the sort of  magnetohydrodynamic saucer that we talked about in the intro. 

    A July 2008 Scientific American article describes the concept:

The saucer will hover and propel itself using electrodes that cover its surface to ionize the surrounding air into plasma. Gases (such as air, which has an equal number of positive and negative charges) become plasma (http://www.plasmacoalition.org/what.htm) when energy (such as heat or electricity) causes some of the gas's atoms to lose their negatively charged electrons, creating atoms with a positive charge, or positive ions, surrounded by the newly detached electrons. Using an onboard source of energy (such as a battery, ultracapacitor, solar panel or any combination thereof), the electrodes will send an electrical current into the plasma, causing the plasma to push against the neutral (noncharged) air surrounding the craft, theoretically generating enough h force for liftoff and movement in different directions (depending on where on the craft's surface you direct the electrical current).

The last we heard, Roy was working on a miniature version of the saucer, 6 inches in diameter, to demonstrate how a full-size saucer would work. As Scientific American notes, the biggest technical challenge to building a WEAV big enough to carry passengers would be making the vehicle light, yet powerful enough to lift both its cargo and energy source.

Possibly, the answer may be to use a lightweight ceramic material that also is a good conductor of electricity. (Maybe a ceramic reinforced with carbon nanotubes would do the trick.)

    So what do you think? Are flying saucers in our future, or not? Express your opinion below.

Comments

[Astroboy]

I WANT ONE!!!!!!

[Miethe]

How would you power the magnetohydrodynamic drive itself?

[Caffeine Driven Stress Magnet]

This is a crazy idea, but kind of cool, too.

[Jim Rock]

I still don't quite understand what advantages the saucer shape has. Is it more energy efficient, or superior aerodynamically

[Mr. Joyboy]

These would be very useful for traveling in urban areas, because of the vertical takeoff and landing capability. I predict that flying saucers would become a major form of transportation!

[Dr. Strange]

It seems like the magnetic drive is the real innovation here, not the saucer shape.

[Mothra]

Cool. It's better than flying paper plates, like in "Queen of Outer Space." I'd like one. The little personal ones, like in "The Jetsons."

[Skeptic]

Are we talking about flying saucers for space exploration, for the military, or for civilian transportation?

[Natural Man]

flying saucers are a sign of the approaching end times.

[ET]

Or of an impending golden age.

[The One]

natural man get a life lol end times lol maybe for you

[The One]

but yes i dont find this to be a plausable idea

[Canadian]

Hey, was that you I heard on the CBC radio this morning?

[Astroboy]

Why isn't it plausible??????????

[David]

Its basically creating a "bouyancy" effect but in terms of magnetic bouyancy. It is essential the same effect but just different methods of acquiring it. The flying saucer shape (disc-shape) is more effective at quick maneuvarability because there arent any wings. Meaning it can stop and go in any direction on the the plane it is travelling in almost instantaneously. The REAL engineering problem isnt creating the craft. It is figuring out a way to reduce the g's felt by the pilot as the impulse created by such a drastic direction change can knock out a pilot even if your travelling just 55mph. I have been toyying with the idea of magnetic bouyancy for a while now waiting to see when someone will research it. (I dont have the funding or knowledge required to do something to such extent) But this is definitely a step in the right direction as it doesnt require fossil fuels. However, one should be worried about this electromagnetic hydrodynamic drive producing radiation. The radiation produced might be insignificant but it will most definitely be producing radiation.

[Patrick Kiger]

hey David, thanks for those insights. I hadn't thought about the radiation issue.

[Tommy Caruthers]

didn't the Air Force try to build a flying saucer in the 1950s?

[Patrick Kiger]

Popular Mechanics says so. I haven't checked into their claims.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military_law/1281221.html

[Bill Hogan]

Now if they can just get a Roomba airborne . . .

[Madame Blavatsky]

I like Bill's idea!

[Terry Miller]

In Nick Cook's book, "The Search for Zero Point," he talks about the possibility that the Nazi scientists were using anti-gravity technology (rather than jet engines) to propel their flying saucers. I am wondering why no one is trying to utilize that approach now.

[Jim Rock]

I still don't see the advantage of the saucer shape.

[Transformer]

You can't fly sideways or up and down with fixed wings and a fuselage.

[lecandotnet]

A Vietnamese American had filed a patent application at the US Patent Office for the new motor which doens't require any jet or propeller to walk like a snake. He apllied for grant but he was denied by President George Bush administration by a reason: No money!

However, former President George Bush campained to give Russìa 6 billions of dollars in aid.

Do you thing that granting or aiding the communists is a helpful and graceful President? The former President did not agree about the grant.

The above patent applicant is hoping that our new President would agree on grants to promote the growth for our economy and technology by granting to build it:

Self Propelled Motor.

If the Hollywood director George Lucas likes the above motor to be installed for the new space fighters, he can get the deal with reasonable Hollywood money for his next Star War movies!

You can open below messageboard to click and view the Patent Story, and then read raremath to believe the new technology:

http://www.lecan.net/cgi-bin/message1.cgi

[Skeptic]

Sounds interesting, but I had trouble figuring out the web page you posted.